Cross-shopping midsize and full size? (Myth?)

Fightnfire

Fightnfire

Moderator
Tim,

In a handful of your videos, and other review sites videos, I've heard that according to the manufacturers customer don't cross shop midsize and full size trucks. From the first time I heard that it got me thinking about the topic. I myself have cross shopped in 2011 when moving back into a pickup. I had a limited budget and at that point in time was looking for a low miles used truck that could haul a small family and a small 3,500lb travel trailer. I ended up with a 2009 Tacoma mainly because it was many thousands of dollars less than a lightly used low miles half ton.

As I'm looking around the site, and others, I notice that a lot of people are cross shopping but go full size because they can't justify >$45,000 for a mid size truck with the options they want. As I listen to my friends, and see stories of this online I can't help but feel either times are changing and people are cross shopping now or they always have and the manufacturers are feeding us a line.

I just priced out a 2024 Chevy Silverado Custom Trail Boss 2.7 CrewCab 4WD, added the trailer brake controller ($275) and Safety confidence package ($390). Tow rating is max of 9,600 lbs. Total with options incl. destination is $46,660.

A 2024 Chevy Colorado Trail Boss 2.7 4WD with the same options, Towing and Safety (which required the addition of a convienence package) comes out to $40,145.

For Toyota the 2024 Tundra SR5 CrewCab 5.5' box 4WD is $52,400 incl. dest.

The 2024 Tacoma CrewCab SR5 5' 4WD with cheapest towing package is $44,970.

The Tundra base price seems to be higher, I can only assume not having a cheaper drivetrain option hurts their base price in comparison to Chevy/Ford/Ram. I'm very surprised that you can get in a Trail Boss Silverado for only $2k more than a similarly equipped SR5 Tacoma. If you drop the Trail Boss package, the Silverado would actually be cheaper. It seems like the price gap has disappeared.

Is it safe to say that because midsize trucks have gotten so expensive, looking right at the '24 Tacoma specifically, there's a chance more and more cross shopping is happening and midsize sales could suffer?

I just don't buy the line that consumers don't cross shop the two. I think there is a very specific small segment of midsize owners who won't but more and more seem to be.
 
Fightnfire said:
Tim,

In a handful of your videos, and other review sites videos, I've heard that according to the manufacturers customer don't cross shop midsize and full size trucks. From the first time I heard that it got me thinking about the topic. I myself have cross shopped in 2011 when moving back into a pickup. I had a limited budget and at that point in time was looking for a low miles used truck that could haul a small family and a small 3,500lb travel trailer. I ended up with a 2009 Tacoma mainly because it was many thousands of dollars less than a lightly used low miles half ton.

As I'm looking around the site, and others, I notice that a lot of people are cross shopping but go full size because they can't justify >$45,000 for a mid size truck with the options they want. As I listen to my friends, and see stories of this online I can't help but feel either times are changing and people are cross shopping now or they always have and the manufacturers are feeding us a line.

I just priced out a 2024 Chevy Silverado Custom Trail Boss 2.7 CrewCab 4WD, added the trailer brake controller ($275) and Safety confidence package ($390). Tow rating is max of 9,600 lbs. Total with options incl. destination is $46,660.

A 2024 Chevy Colorado Trail Boss 2.7 4WD with the same options, Towing and Safety (which required the addition of a convienence package) comes out to $40,145.

For Toyota the 2024 Tundra SR5 CrewCab 5.5' box 4WD is $52,400 incl. dest.

The 2024 Tacoma CrewCab SR5 5' 4WD with cheapest towing package is $44,970.

The Tundra base price seems to be higher, I can only assume not having a cheaper drivetrain option hurts their base price in comparison to Chevy/Ford/Ram. I'm very surprised that you can get in a Trail Boss Silverado for only $2k more than a similarly equipped SR5 Tacoma. If you drop the Trail Boss package, the Silverado would actually be cheaper. It seems like the price gap has disappeared.

Is it safe to say that because midsize trucks have gotten so expensive, looking right at the '24 Tacoma specifically, there's a chance more and more cross shopping is happening and midsize sales could suffer?

I just don't buy the line that consumers don't cross shop the two. I think there is a very specific small segment of midsize owners who won't but more and more seem to be.
Click to expand...

I can say that in the last 4 years I shopped for a truck twice, partly due to COVID vehicle resale ability and partly due to me putting 100k miles on my first truck in about 3.5 years lol.

Both times I cross shopped midsize and full size trucks. Price and value for my dollar was the driving factor. I wanted a truck with the following items:
- 4WD/ AWD (Live in Chicago and its a must)
- Crew Cab
- Reliability
- 30-35k price range (used not new, I can afford them prices)
- less than 30k miles
- apple carplay (only "luxury" I could part with
- Payload

Things I didn't focus on much
- MPG... I mean its a truck if it gets good MPG that's just a huge plus
- interior trim (didn't need leather or a sunroof etc.) if it came with it cool if not cool
- Color etc

I bought a 2019 Honda ridgeline AWD RTL-T first (honestly loved it) and then traded it for a 2019 Nissan Titan S 4x4... Both had 30-31k miles, clean carfax and came with Certified used warranties. Both cost 31K. The Honda was a smoother ride, better trim/ more interior luxury, better MPG, and just enough space for my wife and I... But lacked towing power and was a little soft in appearance and when I traded it had 100+k miles and was due for services. The Nissan has more space, more towing and larger bed, but lacks ride quality compared to the Honda and comfort features.

I looked at the diesel Colorado but price was too high, the 2.7 Silverado but reliability was still a question mark for me, the ram 1500 V8 but price for trim and mileage was more than i wanted to deal with and ford is just not my style. Toyota tundra's were my love but I couldn't afford the "yota tax" and the new Nissan frontier was awesome but too new for affordable used availability (my dad bought one 2 months ago though for 28.5k with 10k miles. lol.

so I agree with you sir. people do cross shop.
 
Fightnfire said:
Tim,

In a handful of your videos, and other review sites videos, I've heard that according to the manufacturers customer don't cross shop midsize and full size trucks. From the first time I heard that it got me thinking about the topic. I myself have cross shopped in 2011 when moving back into a pickup. I had a limited budget and at that point in time was looking for a low miles used truck that could haul a small family and a small 3,500lb travel trailer. I ended up with a 2009 Tacoma mainly because it was many thousands of dollars less than a lightly used low miles half ton.

As I'm looking around the site, and others, I notice that a lot of people are cross shopping but go full size because they can't justify >$45,000 for a mid size truck with the options they want. As I listen to my friends, and see stories of this online I can't help but feel either times are changing and people are cross shopping now or they always have and the manufacturers are feeding us a line.

I just priced out a 2024 Chevy Silverado Custom Trail Boss 2.7 CrewCab 4WD, added the trailer brake controller ($275) and Safety confidence package ($390). Tow rating is max of 9,600 lbs. Total with options incl. destination is $46,660.

A 2024 Chevy Colorado Trail Boss 2.7 4WD with the same options, Towing and Safety (which required the addition of a convienence package) comes out to $40,145.

For Toyota the 2024 Tundra SR5 CrewCab 5.5' box 4WD is $52,400 incl. dest.

The 2024 Tacoma CrewCab SR5 5' 4WD with cheapest towing package is $44,970.

The Tundra base price seems to be higher, I can only assume not having a cheaper drivetrain option hurts their base price in comparison to Chevy/Ford/Ram. I'm very surprised that you can get in a Trail Boss Silverado for only $2k more than a similarly equipped SR5 Tacoma. If you drop the Trail Boss package, the Silverado would actually be cheaper. It seems like the price gap has disappeared.

Is it safe to say that because midsize trucks have gotten so expensive, looking right at the '24 Tacoma specifically, there's a chance more and more cross shopping is happening and midsize sales could suffer?

I just don't buy the line that consumers don't cross shop the two. I think there is a very specific small segment of midsize owners who won't but more and more seem to be.
Click to expand...
This is actually the second time this week I've been asked this question (another was an email). I should do a video.

I'm looking to do your same build and I'm not seeing any safety confidence package for the Silverado. Where did you find it?

Also, my starting price for the Silverado 1500 crew cab custom trail boss is $53,795.
 
testerdahl said:
This is actually the second time this week I've been asked this question (another was an email). I should do a video.

I'm looking to do your same build and I'm not seeing any safety confidence package for the Silverado. Where did you find it?

Also, my starting price for the Silverado 1500 crew cab custom trail boss is $53,795.
Click to expand...
That was in error. I have no idea how it happened but I went to Chevrolet.com and somehow ended up on the 2022 pricing page. Here is a pic of my browser history from yesterday:

1705683823803.png

The first link takes me here:
1705683888179.png

All I did was naviagte to Build and price the Silverado and somehow ended up on the 2022 page... I don't know, weird, and a mistake on my part somehow. My fault.

Clicking through the history links here is the safety confidence package:
1705684084649.png

So, I don't know what happened, honest mistake. I'm thinking there was an error on Chevy's page and somehow it put me into the 2022 build and price and I didn't catch it.

For a 2024 this is what I get for a Custom Trail Boss, looks like there are some discounts right now:

1705684477590.png

1705684508576.png
1705684542544.png
1705684565820.png
 
That 2024 Silverado includes the trailering package at that price, I can't tell if that includes the trailer brake controller to get that in the 24 Tacoma TRD OR the price is up to $47,920. That's a base OR with the cheapest package that includes the TBC.
 

Attachments

  • 1705685077889.png
    1705685077889.png
    119.2 KB · Views: 0
My overall feeling on this is that we haven't seen the TRD Pro or Trailhunter pricing yet, nor the add-on cost for the hybrid system on a TRD OR or Sport. When those two things are out I imagine a lot of jaws are going to hit the floor.

What's the MSRP going to be on the TRD Pro? 60? 62? 64? It's a bout $55k for a premium OR... how much more are the Pro/Trailhunter goodies plus the hybrid going to run?

At those prices, people are going to look at a full size. They may still choose Tacoma but they're looking.
 
Fightnfire said:
My overall feeling on this is that we haven't seen the TRD Pro or Trailhunter pricing yet, nor the add-on cost for the hybrid system on a TRD OR or Sport. When those two things are out I imagine a lot of jaws are going to hit the floor.

What's the MSRP going to be on the TRD Pro? 60? 62? 64? It's a bout $55k for a premium OR... how much more are the Pro/Trailhunter goodies plus the hybrid going to run?

At those prices, people are going to look at a full size. They may still choose Tacoma but they're looking.
Click to expand...
You definitely bring up some good points. I'm just thinking how I can do this in a way that would add value and have the visuals to back it up. Right now, I'm looking at using an old video I shot of the Ridgeline vs a GMC Sierra 1500. I think it would illustrate the point on size, payload, bed volume, interior room space, etc...

I'm creatively tapped out today. I'll see if I can get after it in the morning.
 
Here's a 2024 Chevy Silverado Double Cab Custom 4WD with a dealer applied lift, AT tires and a Trailer brake controller - $46,495. The rear legroom on this truck is about a 1/2" more than the 2024 Chevy Colorado. 9000lb max trailering. (I didn't know they still offered the old interior infotainment on a 2024)

1705702091406.png
1705702125942.png
1705702148905.png
1705702180223.png


$46,495 for that truck.
 
Fightnfire said:
Tim,

In a handful of your videos, and other review sites videos, I've heard that according to the manufacturers customer don't cross shop midsize and full size trucks. From the first time I heard that it got me thinking about the topic. I myself have cross shopped in 2011 when moving back into a pickup. I had a limited budget and at that point in time was looking for a low miles used truck that could haul a small family and a small 3,500lb travel trailer. I ended up with a 2009 Tacoma mainly because it was many thousands of dollars less than a lightly used low miles half ton.

As I'm looking around the site, and others, I notice that a lot of people are cross shopping but go full size because they can't justify >$45,000 for a mid size truck with the options they want. As I listen to my friends, and see stories of this online I can't help but feel either times are changing and people are cross shopping now or they always have and the manufacturers are feeding us a line.

I just priced out a 2024 Chevy Silverado Custom Trail Boss 2.7 CrewCab 4WD, added the trailer brake controller ($275) and Safety confidence package ($390). Tow rating is max of 9,600 lbs. Total with options incl. destination is $46,660.

A 2024 Chevy Colorado Trail Boss 2.7 4WD with the same options, Towing and Safety (which required the addition of a convienence package) comes out to $40,145.

For Toyota the 2024 Tundra SR5 CrewCab 5.5' box 4WD is $52,400 incl. dest.

The 2024 Tacoma CrewCab SR5 5' 4WD with cheapest towing package is $44,970.

The Tundra base price seems to be higher, I can only assume not having a cheaper drivetrain option hurts their base price in comparison to Chevy/Ford/Ram. I'm very surprised that you can get in a Trail Boss Silverado for only $2k more than a similarly equipped SR5 Tacoma. If you drop the Trail Boss package, the Silverado would actually be cheaper. It seems like the price gap has disappeared.

Is it safe to say that because midsize trucks have gotten so expensive, looking right at the '24 Tacoma specifically, there's a chance more and more cross shopping is happening and midsize sales could suffer?

I just don't buy the line that consumers don't cross shop the two. I think there is a very specific small segment of midsize owners who won't but more and more seem to be.
Click to expand...
i go back and forth between a new Colorado or Ranger (whenever they start building them with the 2.7) or a used (2020ish) Tundra.
 
Fightnfire said:
Here's a 2024 Chevy Silverado Double Cab Custom 4WD with a dealer applied lift, AT tires and a Trailer brake controller - $46,495. The rear legroom on this truck is about a 1/2" more than the 2024 Chevy Colorado. 9000lb max trailering. (I didn't know they still offered the old interior infotainment on a 2024)

View attachment 105
View attachment 106
View attachment 107
View attachment 108


$46,495 for that truck.
Click to expand...
I didn’t know that either. The Custom trim is a nicer work truck per marketing. I remember them geeking out how you could get a Custom Trail Boss. They were pretty excited to offer that and at a lower price.

That reminds me how funny it is at times to listen to consumers talk about how expensive new trucks have gotten and then you talk with Chevy marketing and engineering folks and they are complaining about it as well.

I remember how excited Chevy was and how over the moon Sheldon Brown was to offer a Tacoma XtraCab with at $30k.

The facts are mandatory safety equipment, emissions targets and building trucks for a wide-ranging audience just means a more expensive truck. I know so many engineers who have bought the base level and modified it to their needs themselves. They are frustrated as well with how things are done at times. It is just a business and trying to hit internal targets setup based on market research for the most common buyer.
 
Hi, Tim. I just watched your cross shopping discussion with All Terrain Nation. Really enjoyed it and agreed with the points, some of which I hadn’t been able to put my finger on until hearing you guys talk. I agree with ATN, in my day-to-day life, i think I’d prefer the maneuverability, parkability, and garageability of it. I’m not a guy who has full size truck needs like towing heaving loads, carrying heavy cargo, or going off-reading. But, what sends my thinking back around to full size is what you said about having more space inside the cab, rear seat room, flat loading floors in the back (easier for dogs to get into), the more planted, solid ride for towing when I own a boat someday. The other reason goes to someone else’s comment I saw on the forum a few days ago…just pure desire. I love V-8s. Like ATN said, cars (and cars with V-8s) are going away and one reason I want a full size is because that’s what gives me the most options for having a V-8.

Now, if manufacturer’s would make flat loading floors in the back of midsize crew cab trucks or, even better, flat floor with removable back seats, I’d be tempted to get a midsize truck and a used convertible GT500 to satisfy all my cravings.
 
Tim, your video came out well and brought up great points. I know I am cross-shopping but most people I know don't even think about going down to mid-size or up to full-size. I think the biggest thing with trucks is that so many shoppers are shopping with emotion vice logic. First you have the biggest group of brand loyalists in the automotive world and next the biggest factor, the "macho" aspect. Hell, I have a buddy who bought an F-250 Tremor Diesel to drive four miles back and forth to work. No kids, small dog. He fully admits he cannot back a trailer and will not go off-road. He does pull a SxS on a small trailer with it but will unhook it and move the trailer vice backing it up. That's a pure emotional purchase. With marketing the way it is, people just feel they need the most power, lockers, towing capability, etc. to even do the minimalist truck tasks. But it seems like just yesterday, Chevy Luvs, Ford Couriers and Datsuns were plenty of truck for most.

My logic is about what I need and can afford.
Cab size- I have no need nor desire to make my truck a family vehicle as my son is out of the house and the wife and I usually take her car when together. One must remember how often they drive by themselves. I do need some back seat "case-space". You know, gun case or a case of beer so a regular cab is out as well as the Toy extra cab with no door. I may even pull the rear seats to gain extra space back there.
Towing-I have downsized my trailer to a 16ft enclosed so it maxes out around 5.5k lbs. Most mid-size can handle that, (Sorry Honda) but a brake controller is mandatory. Yeah, you can add it, but full integration always works better.
Drive train- I'd be more impressed with a 4cyl that can do everything I need than a big V8 that has been unchanged since the 60s and does the same job. (Full disclaimer- I grew up on Jeep I6 so no V8 love) I do need 4wd for the times I go to camp and my hunting excursions as well as winter driving. But unlike others, I know enough about four wheeling that I do not need the exotic systems. Even the Taco Off-road is over kill for most, they just don't want to admit it. Toyota FT 4wd would be perfect but I'd settle for less.
Bed size- I do a lot of stuff around the house, so I do need a bed for tools, dirt, lumber, etc. A 5ftr is small, but doable. Real long lumber hangs out of 6ftr so what's another foot? I'm not a contractor and don't pretend to be so no need for bigger. By the way, I drove a 2020 Ram with Ram-boxes for a year, best truck bed ever....
Comfort/Convenience- I do love gadgets. Gotta have my heated seats & wheel. Wireless phone connection and charging are a huge plus to me as well. Good cameras are also handy, especially the front ones when traveling on off-road snow-covered wood roads. Radar cruise is a wonderful thing to have as well as powered rear window. Yes, they are considered luxuries but if you can make the drive more comfortable, why not? Powered tailgate? Neat but not necessary. Bed lighting is a hell yes though. Powered running boards are nice in a full size, but not sure how hard it is to get in a Taco. The Canyon needs them. Odd entry there.

So, after considering all that? I'm leaning towards the GMC AT4 or the Taco. Priced out equally equipped, the Sport, Off-road & Limited are within $500 of each other at $53.5K and I cannot touch a full-size equipped that way for less than $65-70k. I'd probably go for the limited except for the fact I hate chrome and the available colors. Also, the Toyota stupid subscription for remote and cameras that shut off over 10mph sucks as well. The GMC is about $2K less but is less equipped. No powered tailgate or steps or advanced 4wd, which is not particularly bad. The real negative to the GMC is that there is no powered back window, and the back seat frame is ridiculous. Fold the seat up and you have this completely uneven surface to load "cases". That'll suck to overcome. Plus, you need to add steps to the Canyon, getting in the cab is that weird to me. Gonna be a tough decision.

Right now, I can get a leftover 23 Ram Laramie Crew diesel for $55K, $19K off of sticker, but I know those deals are few and far between and will be gone shortly.
 
I came to a decision a month ago that it was time to replace my 2008 Toyota Highlander. I also came to the decision that this time around I was going to buy the vehicle I wanted rather than what seemed practical.

This inevitably had me looking at pickup trucks. Initially, I started looking at mid-sized tucks such as the Canyon/Colorado and the Tacoma. In fact, I’d pretty much settled on a Canyon AT4, but had some reservations, namely, that’s a lot of $ for a mid-size.

Jumped into the Sierra 1500 build tool and soon found the price delta between the Canyon AT4 and the Sierra AT4, as I’d optioned the, was only about $8000. The ball started swinging in favor of the full size.

Was the 3.0L Diesel, the additional roominess of the cab, and to my eyes what seemed like better quality materials worth the $18k? I’d also be losing the ability to park my new toy in the garage, but winters where I live in NC aren’t all that bad. In the end I did select the full size, but mid-sized trucks were definitely considered.
 
Last edited:
chaseydog said:
I came to a decision a month ago that it was time to replace my 2008 Toyota Highlander. I also came to the decision that this time around I was going to buy the vehicle I wanted rather than what seemed practical.

This inevitably had me looking at pickup trucks. Initially, I started looking at mid-sized tucks such as the Canyon/Colorado and the Tacoma. In fact, I’d pretty much settled on a Canyon AT4, but had some reservations, namely, that’s a lot of $ for a mid-size.

Jumped into the Sierra 1500 build tool and soon found the price delta between the Canyon AT4 and the Sierra AT4, as I’d optioned the, was only about $8000. The ball started swinging in favor of the full size.

Was the 3.0L Diesel, the additional roominess of the cab, and to my eyes what seemed like better quality materials worth the $18k? I’d also be losing the ability to park my new toy in the garage, but winters where I live in NC aren’t all that bad. In the end I did select the full size, but mid-sized trucks were definitely considered.
Click to expand...

Grats on the truck! Your post is exactly the point I was intending to make, when people look at the options they want in a mid-sized often they find they can get a similar if not better full size and he price gap isn't is extreme as it used to be.

I'm hearing more and more people shopping midsize and end up purchasing full size because they get so much more for their dollar.

Tim's video took the opposite approach but looking at sales over the last year in mid-size and full size I think more people are going full size after cross shopping, that's just an opinion.
 
chaseydog said:
Jumped into the Sierra 1500 build tool and soon found the price delta between the Canyon AT4 and the Sierra AT4, as I’d optioned the, was only about $8000. The ball started swinging in favor of the full size.

Was the 3.0L Diesel, the additional roominess of the cab, and to my eyes what seemed like better quality materials worth the $18k? I’d also be losing the ability to park my new toy in the garage, but winters where I live in NC aren’t all that bad. In the end I did select the full size, but mid-sized trucks were definitely considered.
Click to expand...
Just to clarify, you paid $18K more or $8K more for the full-size? And also, congrats! Always awesome to get a new truck.
 
chaseydog said:
Long day yesterday. It was 18, 52K for the AT4 Canyon 70K for the AT4 Sierra 1500
Click to expand...
Gotcha. That's the price I'm seeing around me as well. Except not many Canyons, lots of Sierras though. Biggest deals seem to be on 23 Rams but they're the oldest design out there so that makes sense. I much prefer the looks of the GMC. Right now, I think they are the best looking 1500 out there.
 
Dusdaddy said:
Gotcha. That's the price I'm seeing around me as well. Except not many Canyons, lots of Sierras though. Biggest deals seem to be on 23 Rams but they're the oldest design out there so that makes sense. I much prefer the looks of the GMC. Right now, I think they are the best looking 1500 out there.
Click to expand...

Agreed, I still prefer the 18-22 1/2 GMC look over the 23-24 but I do think it's still the best looking half ton on the road. Ford looks soft and seemingly getting softer by the year.
 
Yep, you are right, the 18-22 do look better. I think it's the grill. But not enough to swing me. I just can't accept that price upgrade for such a small benefit of space. With no passengers to carry, and the mid-size equaling my existing 1/2-ton payload/towing, it's a simple choice for me to downsize. The explosion of these new mid-sizes really sold me on it.
 
I would love to cross shop, but an equivalent half-ton, same spec and equipment, with equivalent or less payload weirdly enough is around 20-30k more here in Canada. This is a pretty big difference for a little more space in the bed and cab and some more towing capability. My kids are very young, fuel economy is better in the real world on a midsize, except the 3.0L from GM, and when hunting I can pick my line on the trail instead of just having to try to power trough everything.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top