I've gotten some feedback from my videos that the Canyon AT4 is a better comparison and truck versus the Tacoma TRD Off Road. Thoughts?
Canyon AT4 better than Tacoma TRD Off Road?
- Thread starter testerdahl
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kd70qc
Member
Fighting Words:
The non-hybrid Taco seems underpowered from the start. That motor seems like the perfect answer to the 2019 Ford 2.3, but this is almost 2024. I wonder how the hybrid will do under load after the battery is expended (e.g. towing or loaded in the mountains). The GM 2.7 is the motor to beat right now, with the Ford 2.7 coming soon. It will be interesting see how their suspensions, and refinement compare on and off road, with and without a load. (Weekenders vs Overlanders.).
Toyota and Nissan have kept multiple cab and bed configurations in the midsize class. That is something Ford and GM can't compete with.
I was a total Japanese fanboy until my last (08) Tundra. Now, I'm not so sure Toyota/Nissan's reliability offset their lack of power, features, refinement or efficiency. I have no confidence that the first year of the Taco will be trouble free either. If it wasn't for the unreliable infotainment electronics in the American trucks, I think GMC would easily beat the Toyota in refinement, interior design, and drive train, and possibly the suspension.
The non-hybrid Taco seems underpowered from the start. That motor seems like the perfect answer to the 2019 Ford 2.3, but this is almost 2024. I wonder how the hybrid will do under load after the battery is expended (e.g. towing or loaded in the mountains). The GM 2.7 is the motor to beat right now, with the Ford 2.7 coming soon. It will be interesting see how their suspensions, and refinement compare on and off road, with and without a load. (Weekenders vs Overlanders.).
Toyota and Nissan have kept multiple cab and bed configurations in the midsize class. That is something Ford and GM can't compete with.
I was a total Japanese fanboy until my last (08) Tundra. Now, I'm not so sure Toyota/Nissan's reliability offset their lack of power, features, refinement or efficiency. I have no confidence that the first year of the Taco will be trouble free either. If it wasn't for the unreliable infotainment electronics in the American trucks, I think GMC would easily beat the Toyota in refinement, interior design, and drive train, and possibly the suspension.
Tim, I've been looking hard at an AT4 for my new truck and I have built it many times over the last month. Today, I built it under the 2024 configurator and amazingly, THE PRICE IS LOWER! The base price for a 2023 AT4 is $45,395. The base price for a 2024 AT4 is $44,595. All the options/packages seem to be the same. When built the truck I would get with bed liner, tech & towing maxed out, it's under the $50k mark. That will have the HUD and leather from the Denali without all the chrome. I'm shocked to see a lowering of price. Am I missing something obvious?
Huh. I see the 2024 GMC Canyon build and price is up and I'm getting the same price. I did Google a 2023 AT4 and it says $43,900. I'm not sure what's going on. I trust your word. I just don't know.
Jayray274
Member
My concern with going GM over the Tacoma is the 8speed Trans. I know GM claims they “reworked” it etc. there is already multiple Trucks with fails transmissions. One 24’ has 84 miles on it and the other is a 23’ with 4800.
Regardless of how many or few units that have trans issues already, it’s really not a good look, when your previous generation had boat loads of similar problems.
Regardless of how many or few units that have trans issues already, it’s really not a good look, when your previous generation had boat loads of similar problems.
And those are the sneaky things that have me confused on my warranty question under the used section of the purchasing threads. Quit playing games with pricing!! (said the whiney wanna-be-a-truck-owner-guy)
Beninbeta
Well-known member
Hey Tim, I enjoyed your video on the comparison between the Taco and the AT4. However, I think you needed to add a couple more options to the AT4 once you decided to do the premium package on the Taco. I think the $1500 Tech Plus package on the AT4 would make it pretty close in comparison as well as one of the bedliners. When I optioned one out that way it came to about $50,150 for the AT4. Definitely still $3000 less expensive. Anyway, just wanted to add those thoughts.
I would also add that there have been a decent number of reports about the this infotainment system having issues with the backup camera system and then with it draining the battery during an update leaving the vehicle unusable. I think Andre at TFL also had an issue with the driver display going completely black and having to disconnect the battery. These issues made me a bit worried about the this infotainment and driver display system. I had very much hoped the switch to Android Automotive would have helped to fix the crappy software and issues that most manufacturers have had for a long time, but it seem that it has not. I'm guessing some of the brands felt they could cut expenses on their software development with this new system, but then want to customize the systems without the proper developers on their end. That is just a theory though.
Hopefully, GM figure that out as I did like that system when I drove both of these trucks too. I am worried about GM cutting out the ability to use Android Auto/Carplay in their future vehicles as well. This forces people to have to subscribe to their services for things like navigation, streaming music and other similar things to work.
I would also add that there have been a decent number of reports about the this infotainment system having issues with the backup camera system and then with it draining the battery during an update leaving the vehicle unusable. I think Andre at TFL also had an issue with the driver display going completely black and having to disconnect the battery. These issues made me a bit worried about the this infotainment and driver display system. I had very much hoped the switch to Android Automotive would have helped to fix the crappy software and issues that most manufacturers have had for a long time, but it seem that it has not. I'm guessing some of the brands felt they could cut expenses on their software development with this new system, but then want to customize the systems without the proper developers on their end. That is just a theory though.
Hopefully, GM figure that out as I did like that system when I drove both of these trucks too. I am worried about GM cutting out the ability to use Android Auto/Carplay in their future vehicles as well. This forces people to have to subscribe to their services for things like navigation, streaming music and other similar things to work.
My brother's new GMC Canyon had the infotainment issue as well. It works fine now. Just a new model year glitch. Expect the same with the Tacoma. There's always something. My 2022 Tundra had a fair amount of issues.
Good point on the tech package. Like you said, still leaves a sizable price gap.
For the Android Auto/Apple Carplay issue so far it is just on EVs and GM says it messes with some of the charging navigation software. I expect them to change course considering all the outcry.
Same thing happened and is happening with Toyota over the remote start subscription plus the truck turning off when you open the doors. The new Tacoma stays on thankfully, the Tundra does not. Both offer subscriptions. Every brand has something.
Beninbeta
Well-known member
Agreed, all new tech is going to have issues for sure, and we will be in for subscription hell on all vehicles. Hopefully with Tundra having worked out the kinks that will help everywhere else. I do think the fact that Toyota is sharing so much of the tech between so many platforms will be a huge benefit across the board. I think Ford has a similar advantage there too. GM seems to share across the brands (horizontally) rather that vertically within the models, which is far more work for all of the teams involved, but hopefully the AA platform with help to smooth that out too.
Beninbeta
Well-known member
Also I have had a few software related issues in our 23 Tucson. Mostly transmission, driver assistance related and those have not been fun to deal with when they happen. I do think software is one of the reasons prices have gone up in recent years. I'm glad GM is working out the kinks, the system is very nice otherwise.
You also forgot about adding the moonroof to the Canyon, that's another grand right there. And the upgraded Bose Audio to match the upgraded JBL. I hate to poke holes but since these are the two trucks I'm trying to decide between, I've spent more than a minute on the configurators.
I think a major issue with that comparison is simply that the Off-Road is too far beyond the AT4 to really compare. What I mean, isn't the Taco Sport 4wd closer to the AT4 than the Off-Road? The AT4 has a simple 4wd system, 4H & 4L, like the Sport. The Off-Road has crawl control, fancier cameras, upgraded shocks, etc. More like the AT4X. The only advantage the AT4 has over the Sport is the G80 rear diff but it is way behind the Off-Road in 4wd tech. And honestly, a diff that requires wheel spin to work is no comparison to the electronic diff in the Off-road. I would want to engage the locker before needing it. In the GMC, you must wait until you are stuck. Or you could compare a base Off-Road @ $44.4 and the base AT4 @ $44.6, those two are just as close as can be. One has a bigger screen and heated seats, the other adaptive cruise and better 4wd system.
Beninbeta
Well-known member
These are all great points as well. I forgot about the sunroof and the G80 difference. It becomes hard to make comparisons when shopping for trucks and you often end up making sacrifices with one brand or another in some way. The AT4X or ZR2 is probably a more direct comparison with the Bison or AEV editions being more comparable to the Trailhunter/Pro.
TFL posted a drag race video with the New Taco vs 23 vs the Colorado and it finished how I thought it would. The Colorado was quickest, but the 24 Taco was nearly a second faster than the 23 in zero to 60 and a full second faster in the quarter mile. To me, that improvement was all I needed to see. I just need to be able to pass people when needed and get up to speed on the interstate. Otherwise, I'm most interested in being able to make it to campsites while overlanding. It also looked like the limited attained 24 mpgs with the air dam and 23 without it at elevation in their 100 mile mpg loop. If that holds for the Off-road, the Taco should get better gas mileage than either of the GMs.
Agreed. Which is why I'm leaning towards the Taco. More options on the base models to build up. A Sport 4wd is all I need as long as the options are there to add if I want. The Off-Road is unnecessary for me just like a Raptor or AT4X would be. The Denali and Limited are nice but too much chrome. Although I do like the idea of a HUD as I've never had one. But the Toy does the digital rear-view instead.
Beninbeta
Well-known member
HUDs are cool, but have one huge flaw. If you wear polarized sunglasses, they are nearly useless. But they provide great info at a glance which is great. My 2017 Audi A4 had one and I really did like it when I wasn't wearing sunglasses.
Jayray274
Member
Agree with all this but I’m personally a fan of the sunroof being a separate option. I’m also comparing the Taco vs Canyon So that would save 1K in the GMC. Also the Tacoma is still doggin it compared to the GM twins. So how much $$ should be deducted for the lack of HP in the taco?
Price point wise at what point does a full-size look like a better buy. I know Tim I shouldn’t compare Mid-Size to Full-Size, here we are though. Price and Fuel economy is why the mid-size died off before. Feel like we’re headed back that direction.
Hell, all these digital screens look bad with polarized lenses. I had to order new Oakley's because of it.
True, the GMC does add $1k for the moonroof on anything. The Toyota has to be the $5k package to get that same moonroof. But it would be hard pressed to find a stripped AT4 with just moonroof.Agree with all this but I’m personally a fan of the sunroof being a separate option. I’m also comparing the Taco vs Canyon So that would save 1K in the GMC. Also the Tacoma is still doggin it compared to the GM twins. So how much $$ should be deducted for the lack of HP in the taco?
Price point wise at what point does a full-size look like a better buy. I know Tim I shouldn’t compare Mid-Size to Full-Size, here we are though. Price and Fuel economy is why the mid-size died off before. Feel like we’re headed back that direction.
Beninbeta
Well-known member
I don't think we really are headed back in that direction. People are making that claim you can buy a full-sized truck for what the upper limits are on the mid-sized, but without the same options. Once you add those, full-sized trucks are at least $65k. With Trailhunter and TRD Pro probably pushing those limits, you might have an argument with those, but a TRD Pro Tundra is 72K . so you'd still be saving 8-10k on the Tacoma. Then factor in that full-sized trucks are massive today and cannot go where a mid-sized truck can. If you want to take a vehicle into the wilderness, a mid-sized truck is the place to be. If you need to tow or have a large family, then a full-sized makes sense.
My neighbor recently bought an HD AT4X. He can get it into his garage, but there is about 3mm of space in the front and rear. I'm pretty sure he has to get in/out the passenger side of the truck to be able to drive it. I'll not have that issue with the mid-size and it'll be plenty of room for my wife, dog and I and will provide some amazing experiences where I wouldn't even want to think about trying to take a full-sized truck in the mountains. Anyway, they are different vehicles for different purposes. I think the point is that vehicles are just really expensive now.