Truck Purchase GM vs Toyota

[TheDo114]

Hi folks,

I'm looking to purchase a truck in the end of 2025/start of 2026. The lease on my Ford Ranger is coming to and end in early 2026 and I will not be buying it back. The truck has started giving me a lot of problems, particularly the transmission, driveshaft and bed strength (It dents looking at it wrong). The Ranger5G forums is now filling up with horror stories from owners and I don't have a lot of confidence in the platform for long term ownership.

I want to move up to a half-ton truck. I keep running out of space in the 5 foot bed and unfortunately, both midsize truck that offer a 6 foot bed are the Nissan Frontier, (not enough space for 2 child seat in the back and adults in the front), and the Toyota Tacoma. The 3rd gen plain old sucks and the new one is way too expensive in Canada. There's also even less real world space in the back seat than the Frontier.

Use case:

1. I do around 25 000kms (15 500mi) per year.
2. I drive 60km (37mi) per day to and from work on a mix of side road and highway.
3. I tow and haul around 12 000km (7500mi) per year and a third of that is while off-roading to go hunting. The rest of my towing is on the highway in hilly terrain but no mountain or Ike Gauntlet.
4. I use my truck for commuting, hunting, fishing and spend around 30% of my time off the pavement.
5. Max load I carry is usually 5500 pounds on a utility trailer while the bed is full of the rest of my gear.

Preferences:

1. 4x4 with low ranger.
2. Tow package.
3. Crew Cab.
4. 6 and a half foot bed.
5. Payload.
6. Reliability.
7. Apple Car Play.
8. Hard buttons for climate control and no important function in a screen.
9. Fuel Economy.

Since new truck pricing in Canada is insane, I am considering a used truck to fit my budget. I might consider a new one, if they bring back the crazy offers that were there before COVID like 20k off a truck or something like that. I test drove all of the truck mentioned below.

Trucks that I am considering.

Toyota Tundra 2023 (least preferred option)

1. Pros:
   1. Can get a crew cab with the standard bed.
   2. Fuel economy.
   3. Comfort.
   4. Price.
   5. Seats are nice.
   6. Power is nice and available really low in the RPM band.
   7. Hard buttons.
   8. Towing mirrors available.
2. Cons:
   1. Current recall and how it will be handled.
   2. No front recovery hooks.
   3. Approach angle is atrocious, not sure I could take it where I need to when hunting from factory,
   4. Reliability.
   5. Build quality.
   6. Low payload. My Ranger had 250 pounds more payload than most Tundra's.
   7. Bed space compared to other half-ton truck.
3. Thoughts: Honestly, the recall is really putting me off until we get more information out of it. There's also more cons than pros with this one, but the engine is really fun.

Toyota Tundra 2020 or 2021 (Second)

1. Pros:
   1. Reliability.
   2. Comfort.
   3. Price.
   4. Seats are even better than the new one.
   5. V8 sound.
   6. Simple and rugged interior.
   7. Interior space is insane with the crew cab.
2. Cons:
   1. No standard bed with the crew cab, only the short bed.
   2. Fuel economy.
   3. Power is up really high in the RPM range.
   4. Atrocious payload.
   5. Excessive squat when loaded with a moderate amount of weight.
   6. Towing mirrors are hard to find.
3. Thoughts: I like the simplicity and reliability of this truck. It was comfortable and will stand the test of time. Fuel economy, bed space and squatting are big cons in my book, but I would be willing to live with them.

2022-2023 Chevy Silverado 1500/GMC Sierra 1500 with the 3.0L Diesel (Preferred option)

1. Pros:
   1. Fuel Economy
   2. Smooth power delivery
   3. Price.
   4. Column shifter for more space in the console.
   5. Simple interior.
   6. Real transmission cooler
   7. Can get a crew cab with the standard bed.
   8. Towing mirrors.
   9. Interior space is better than the newer tundra's.
   10. Did I mention fuel economy and smooth power delivery!
2. Cons:
   1. Seat are the least comfortable of all of them.
   2. Visibility is very poor with the high hood and small windshield.
   3. Interior fit and finish. I have yet to be in a truck that did not have a rattle or a weird fitting interior panel.
   4. Unknown long term reliability
   5. Diesel and the maintenance and considerations that come with it.
3. Thoughts: Man was I impressed by this truck, Came with everything I wanted and the engine is unreal. I can see why owners and @testerdahl rave about it all the time. The fuel economy is insance for a pickup truck and it checks all of my boxes except reliability. Maintenance and emisisions equipment bother me, but not enough to be completly turned off. I'm just wondering if it's worth it in the long run to try to deal with that.

I know this post is very long and full of mistakes, english is not my first language, but I would appreciate your toughts and opinions on it.

I did not include Ford and Ram since Ford has 100000000000 quality problems in the past 5-6 years and RAM has the same problems on their truck since the 90's and seems like they can update everything but the issues on their trucks.

Cheers.

 

[testerdahl]

Well you have certainly done your research. That was a great read!

I think it really comes down to new Tundra vs GM with the diesel. The prior-gen Tundra is really good, I just think MPG is going to kill you over time. I owned one and never saw better than like 15 MPG. It got old fast passing everything except for the gas station.

I'd just hold for now and see what the recall fix is going to be for that one.

As you stated, I'm a big fan of the diesel. Can't you delete the emissions in Canada if something goes wonky?

 

[TheDo114]

Well you have certainly done your research. That was a great read!

I think it really comes down to new Tundra vs GM with the diesel. The prior-gen Tundra is really good, I just think MPG is going to kill you over time. I owned one and never saw better than like 15 MPG. It got old fast passing everything except for the gas station.

I'd just hold for now and see what the recall fix is going to be for that one.

As you stated, I'm a big fan of the diesel. Can't you delete the emissions in Canada if something goes wonky?

Thanks for the reply. I appreciate it.

For MPG, yeah I was running the math on it and with the difference in MPG, I could afford between 1500$ and 3000$ in either repairs or mods per year. That's a lot of money.

For the diesel emission stuff, I can and can't.
I can if I plan to run this truck into the ground, never ever sell it or trade it in and if the law doesn't change.
I can't if I want to resell it, since it would have to pass a safety inspection or if they bring back some of the clean air testing they were doing.

 

[Fightnfire]

I'm picking the GM but I am biased as I own a GM. I did come from a 2nd gen Tacoma that I had for 10 years and put 200k on. So, I feel your comments about full size. My two boys grew up in the back of the Tacoma but just didn't fit anymore.

The new Tundra wasn't an option for me when I was looking at new 1/2 tons as I just thought it looked terrible...and now all of the issues. I'm really glad I stepped away from Toyota.

I'm surprised by your comments on fit and finish with the interior of the GM. That's how I feel about Ford but I have never experienced any fit issues with my truck. The wife's Expedition is an interior plastic squeak machine. My dad's ford is similar. Have you sat in Chevy's and GMC's? I ask because of interior quality and the seeing over the dash, the GMC should be better in both places. I think the 3.0 is the best 1/2 ton engine out right now and for the last few years but you're right in that we don't really know how long it's going to last.

Good luck with your search!

 

[chaseydog]

I have no issues with fit and finish on my 24 AT4 3.0L. Just over 6000 miles, and other than a single CEL, that cleared itself later that day, no issues with the engine.

 

[TheDo114]

I'm picking the GM but I am biased as I own a GM. I did come from a 2nd gen Tacoma that I had for 10 years and put 200k on. So, I feel your comments about full size. My two boys grew up in the back of the Tacoma but just didn't fit anymore.

The new Tundra wasn't an option for me when I was looking at new 1/2 tons as I just thought it looked terrible...and now all of the issues. I'm really glad I stepped away from Toyota.

I'm surprised by your comments on fit and finish with the interior of the GM. That's how I feel about Ford but I have never experienced any fit issues with my truck. The wife's Expedition is an interior plastic squeak machine. My dad's ford is similar. Have you sat in Chevy's and GMC's? I ask because of interior quality and the seeing over the dash, the GMC should be better in both places. I think the 3.0 is the best 1/2 ton engine out right now and for the last few years but you're right in that we don't really know how long it's going to last.

Good luck with your search!

I have no issues with fit and finish on my 24 AT4 3.0L. Just over 6000 miles, and other than a single CEL, that cleared itself later that day, no issues with the engine.

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it! Can you guys give me your real world MPG? I was able to average around 9.0L/100km (26MPG) ob both of my test drive and I was really impressed since it's better than my Ranger and diesel is cheaper than premium gas here so my fuel cost would decrease going to a half-ton. That blows my mind.

Yeah I did two, 100km/(62mi) test drive of two different 2022 Chevrolet Silverado 1500 RST with the 3.0L and both had different fit and finish issues. The first one had a loose panel that did not want to pop back in and the second, the steering wheel was missing a panel and the dash was rattling. It might have been bad luck since both truck were rentals and repossessions. I don't expect people that can't pay for their trucks to take care of them, especially when the repo man is coming.

 

[Fightnfire]

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it! Can you guys give me your real world MPG? I was able to average around 9.0L/100km (26MPG) ob both of my test drive and I was really impressed since it's better than my Ranger and diesel is cheaper than premium gas here so my fuel cost would decrease going to a half-ton. That blows my mind.

Yeah I did two, 100km/(62mi) test drive of two different 2022 Chevrolet Silverado 1500 RST with the 3.0L and both had different fit and finish issues. The first one had a loose panel that did not want to pop back in and the second, the steering wheel was missing a panel and the dash was rattling. It might have been bad luck since both truck were rentals and repossessions. I don't expect people that can't pay for their trucks to take care of them, especially when the repo man is coming.

I'm in a 6.2 so normal mostly city driving is 16-18, hwy is 18-20 above 70 and 19-22 below 70.

As for fit and finish, I didn't realize you were looking at used. Our Expedition was a fleet rental, not a public rental so make sure you look around. The interiors tend to get beat up in rentals but they should have decent service records. We looked at several expeditions before finding one in great shape.

 

[TheDo114]

I'm in a 6.2 so normal mostly city driving is 16-18, hwy is 18-20 above 70 and 19-22 below 70.

As for fit and finish, I didn't realize you were looking at used. Our Expedition was a fleet rental, not a public rental so make sure you look around. The interiors tend to get beat up in rentals but they should have decent service records. We looked at several expeditions before finding one in great shape.

Thanks!

Yes, my lease is due at the start of 2026. I wanted to give myself plenty of time to do research and test drives to basically know what I want and then all I have to do is find one in good shape used. Probably a 2023 instead of a 2022 since the lease returns for 2023 is at the end of 2025 and during 2026. Would love to lease or buy a new truck again, but a base model GMC/Chevrolet with the 3.0 are in the 70 000$ range after rebates so that's a no go. Unless they start giving 20 000$ off like they used to before covid.

The picture below is for a GMC Sierra 1500 SLE 4WD with the standard bed and the 3.0. It has the X31 off-road package, the trailer brake controller and the spray-in bed liner as options (2300$ of options):

 

[NMTRUCKER]

Thanks!

Yes, my lease is due at the start of 2026. I wanted to give myself plenty of time to do research and test drives to basically know what I want and then all I have to do is find one in good shape used. Probably a 2023 instead of a 2022 since the lease returns for 2023 is at the end of 2025 and during 2026. Would love to lease or buy a new truck again, but a base model GMC/Chevrolet with the 3.0 are in the 70 000$ range after rebates so that's a no go. Unless they start giving 20 000$ off like they used to before covid.

The picture below is for a GMC Sierra 1500 SLE 4WD with the standard bed and the 3.0. It has the X31 off-road package, the trailer brake controller and the spray-in bed liner as options (2300$ of options):

View attachment 520

I did a 1year review of my ‘23 GMC SIERRA 1500 with the LZ0 diesel on this forum (sub category GMC SIERRA). So check it out. At this point I have just over 14,000 miles and no problems or complaints. I don’t know how far off road you travel to your hunting/camping spots but the only concern would be if the diesel needed to do a REGEN when you’re off road. Typically the REGEN requires a speed over 40 mph and takes about 12 minutes. Once the DPF gets to 140% capacity it will go into limp mode. One alternative is to purchase an OBDII scanner that has the capability of doing a stationary REGEN. That would solve your possible off-road REGEN situation. Hope this helps.

 

[TheDo114]

I did a 1year review of my ‘23 GMC SIERRA 1500 with the LZ0 diesel on this forum (sub category GMC SIERRA). So check it out. At this point I have just over 14,000 miles and no problems or complaints. I don’t know how far off road you travel to your hunting/camping spots but the only concern would be if the diesel needed to do a REGEN when you’re off road. Typically the REGEN requires a speed over 40 mph and takes about 12 minutes. Once the DPF gets to 140% capacity it will go into limp mode. One alternative is to purchase an OBDII scanner that has the capability of doing a stationary REGEN. That would solve your possible off-road REGEN situation. Hope this helps.

Thanks, I will definitely check it out.

Awesome info on the regen, I did not know there was a minimum speed for it. My longest trips off-road are usually 350km or 220 miles but preceded and followed by 400km (250mi) of highway. I barely hit 25km/h (15mi/h) most of the time so I guess I would need the tool.

 

[NMTRUCKER]

Thanks, I will definitely check it out.

Awesome info on the regen, I did not know there was a minimum speed for it. My longest trips off-road are usually 350km or 220 miles but preceded and followed by 400km (250mi) of highway. I barely hit 25km/h (15mi/h) most of the time so I guess I would need the tool.

If you wind up with either the LM2 or LZ0 make sure that the OBDII scanner can read the CAN FD bus communication protocols. Since about 2020 GM has switched their communication architecture to this new system. Also make sure before you purchase the scanner that it will do a stationary REGEN on your model and year of truck. It’s definitely worth talking with a manufacturer representative to make sure and not find out that it doesn’t work when you’re 100 miles from nowhere. Best of luck with your truck search and keep us posted.

 

[TheDo114]

If you wind up with either the LM2 or LZ0 make sure that the OBDII scanner can read the CAN FD bus communication protocols. Since about 2020 GM has switched their communication architecture to this new system. Also make sure before you purchase the scanner that it will do a stationary REGEN on your model and year of truck. It’s definitely worth talking with a manufacturer representative to make sure and not find out that it doesn’t work when you’re 100 miles from nowhere. Best of luck with your truck search and keep us posted.

Thank you!

 

[chaseydog]

Can you guys give me your real world MPG?

24 AT4 3.0L with 20" AT's.

Daily drive is a 6 mile each way commute to work, plus some additional sort runs running errands. Weekends typically includes longer 40 - 50 mile drives. I'd consider all of this to be city driving and I'm averaging 23 - 24 mpg.

I recently completed two 700 mile runs on the highway and averaged 30 mpg running at 65 - 75 mph. Drove from my home in NC to my mom's place in NJ on a single tank of fuel and still had about 80 miles of range in the tank.

 

[chaseydog]

Awesome info on the regen, I did not know there was a minimum speed for it.

First time diesel owner but my understanding is that the exhaust system needs to reach a temp of 1100 - 1200 °F during regen to complete the burn of process. Driving at 40 mph would make it easier to maintain that temp long enough to complete the regen, but to the best of my knowledge there is no minimum regen speed. Crawling along at 5mph might not be enough, but I'm guessing 15 - 20mph on a gravel road should be sufficient but may drive up the time to complete the regen.

Remember GM designed the DPF system on the 3.0L to perform the regen process with no operator intervention at all. I like the awareness that I get from the iDash, and I'll typically run a regen to completion, but I've read enough comments from owners who never worry about it and let the truck do its thing to admit I'm likely being overly cautious.

 

[TheDo114]

24 AT4 3.0L with 20" AT's.

Daily drive is a 6 mile each way commute to work, plus some additional sort runs running errands. Weekends typically includes longer 40 - 50 mile drives. I'd consider all of this to be city driving and I'm averaging 23 - 24 mpg.

I recently completed two 700 mile runs on the highway and averaged 30 mpg running at 65 - 75 mph. Drove from my home in NC to my mom's place in NJ on a single tank of fuel and still had about 80 miles of range in the tank.

First time diesel owner but my understanding is that the exhaust system needs to reach a temp of 1100 - 1200 °F during regen to complete the burn of process. Driving at 40 mph would make it easier to maintain that temp long enough to complete the regen, but to the best of my knowledge there is no minimum regen speed. Crawling along at 5mph might not be enough, but I'm guessing 15 - 20mph on a gravel road should be sufficient but may drive up the time to complete the regen.

Remember GM designed the DPF system on the 3.0L to perform the regen process with no operator intervention at all. I like the awareness that I get from the iDash, and I'll typically run a regen to completion, but I've read enough comments from owners who never worry about it and let the truck do its thing to admit I'm likely being overly cautious.

Thank you again.

Fuel economy for that truck looks insane.

As for the regen, I might be able to trigger it since I'm going slow and I'm fully loaded in payload on top of pulling a trailer while in 4x4. It might be enough since there's not a lot of air flow to cool things off.

Seems like an iDash and a good code reader are pretty useful for diesel ownership nowadays. My last run with a diesel truck was with a 2003 7.3L powerstroke F350.

 

[duggydo]

One you don't have on your list is the Toyota 2nd generation double cab. The double cab gives you the longer bed and the back seat is not bad at all. I bought a 2018 SR5 double cab 4x4 a few years ago with low miles on it. I am very happy with the back seat room, bed length, and wheelbase combination. Toyota ruined the double cabs with the 3rd gen. They feel so much more cramped when you get in them.

If you look at a Toyota double cab and don't like it, I'd say you should go with your gut and get the GM since it's your preferred option.

 

[TheDo114]

One you don't have on your list is the Toyota 2nd generation double cab. The double cab gives you the longer bed and the back seat is not bad at all. I bought a 2018 SR5 double cab 4x4 a few years ago with low miles on it. I am very happy with the back seat room, bed length, and wheelbase combination. Toyota ruined the double cabs with the 3rd gen. They feel so much more cramped when you get in them.

If you look at a Toyota double cab and don't like it, I'd say you should go with your gut and get the GM since it's your preferred option.

Thanks for the feedback! I did consider the double cab since it has actually more space in the back seat than my crew cab Ford Ranger. I was able to find one and look at it, but I felt that if I'm going to move up to a full size, I want the full crew max space and not just a slight bump in space.

I'm always maxing out the interior space when going hunting and would appreciate a bigger cab. The pictures bellow usually show the amount of gear I have + the cab being stuffed full to the ceiling and the trailer changes based on what I'm doing.

 

[Dusdaddy]

Thanks for the feedback! I did consider the double cab since it has actually more space in the back seat than my crew cab Ford Ranger. I was able to find one and look at it, but I felt that if I'm going to move up to a full size, I want the full crew max space and not just a slight bump in space.

I'm always maxing out the interior space when going hunting and would appreciate a bigger cab. The pictures bellow usually show the amount of gear I have + the cab being stuffed full to the ceiling and the trailer changes based on what I'm doing.

View attachment 525View attachment 526

That second pic makes me think you guys are loaded up for camp. Fall, camping supplies, and lots of machines. This is what I also need a truck for. Going to camp. I want to go down to a midsize truck, but I am worried about losing so much cargo space. I figure I'll use the trailer that much more.

 

[TheDo114]

That second pic makes me think you guys are loaded up for camp. Fall, camping supplies, and lots of machines. This is what I also need a truck for. Going to camp. I want to go down to a midsize truck, but I am worried about losing so much cargo space. I figure I'll use the trailer that much more.

What are you driving today and how close to maxing out are you? Mid-size can be perfect for one or two guys and the duration of the trip. But the size of the bed is what is killing it for me. If you like the new Tacoma or Frontier, they both have a 6 foot bed option that could be use.

 

[Dusdaddy]

I've got a Ram 1500 and I don't max it out weight wise but sometimes I have it loaded pretty full. Last year I downsized my enclosed trailer to a 16-footer since I sold the SxS and that dropped my towing needs to around 5K. My camp is 500 miles away and I make the trip 4-5 times a year. All the midsize will work fine for me as they damn near have the same towing and payload as my 1500. It's physical space and how it is configured that matters to me. Pretty sure they'd all do the job fine. I may just need to load more in the trailer than I used to but that's no big deal. A 6' bed would be roomier but then the truck won't be much shorter than what I have now.